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Post by jemappellekat on Aug 11, 2010 2:50:37 GMT -8
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Post by Weekender on Aug 11, 2010 8:34:53 GMT -8
I never had an artist sketch for me (due to geographical limits), but this is unacceptable............ (Assuming its a random sketch thing from an unpaid art event) *
*assuming epicfai's argument.
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Post by epicfai on Aug 11, 2010 12:01:14 GMT -8
I suppose one could argue that since the sketch was from an expensive & exclusive paid event, i.e. baby tattooville, that the sketch wasn't free (the seller claims they are from that event). Isn't one of the selling points of baby tattooville that participants can spend time with the artists and get sketches, etc? Essentially they're selling access to the artists (at a high price) so I don't really view sketches from that event as being freebies. That being the case, this doesnt really bother me. On the other hand, if these were truly free sketches I would agree that it seems pretty mercenary and disrespectful to the artists. Just my .02 for what little they're worth. BTW - as a disclaimer, i have never been to baby tattooville nor am I the seller of these sketches!  |
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Post by Weekender on Aug 11, 2010 12:20:36 GMT -8
I suppose one could argue that since the sketch was from an expensive & exclusive paid event, i.e. baby tattooville, that the sketch wasn't free (the seller claims they are from that event). Isn't one of the selling points of baby tattooville that participants can spend time with the artists and get sketches, etc? Essentially they're selling access to the artists (at a high price) so I don't really view sketches from that event as being freebies. That being the case, this doesnt really bother me. On the other hand, if these were truly free sketches I would agree that it seems pretty mercenary and disrespectful to the artists. Just my .02 for what little they're worth. BTW - as a disclaimer, i have never been to baby tattooville nor am I the seller of these sketches! Well said : ) |
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Post by mistersmith on Aug 11, 2010 13:18:14 GMT -8
All of us have likely received a good deal of free stuff and hook-ups from artists over the years...and all of us have either refused to sell those pieces, or at least felt really bad when doing it...and that's why we're the ones that still get hooked up!
From the reports I've seen you walk out of Baby Tattooville with a mini-collection, I think it's ok if you move one or two of those. And the Kawasaki stuff linked isn't all that personalized (I'm assuming). But yeah, there are far too many people that just don't care. You can't stop the not a very nice persons, you just have to work on not being one.
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Post by primitiveflesh on Aug 11, 2010 14:36:09 GMT -8
If an artist will not do a 2 min. sketch for you because they are afraid it might get put up on ebay, then they probably aren't producing art for the right reasons.
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Post by twocool4u1 on Aug 11, 2010 14:57:52 GMT -8
This Ebayer (Russcel) as well as another one (Wackyfunshop) are the same person or have some type of connection with each other. I talked to this person at Baby Tattooville. He said he had a partner that bought and sold animation cels. He was buying lots of art. He bought multiple copies of the exclusive Audrey Kawasaki prints (Letting Go and Reconcile), which later appeared on eBay. He also bought a Jeff Soto "Spring Bees" AP lithograph. He bought the Soto for $50 and was selling it online for $450. I also saw his AK exclusive paintings on eBay.
The artists at Baby Tattooville are just hanging out. You can ask them for sketches. Most will give you a quick sketch. Some will decline. You pay to attend, which includes a couple nights stay at a really nice hotel. You get a big collection of goodie bags. Plus you get to hang out with artists and witness art being made. The "free" sketches are not guaranteed.
I guess the point is, this guy is a flipper. However I've been known to buy stuff to eventually sell it at times as well. I do not make my living off of doing that though. And I've never sold any free sketches that I have received.
Edit - I'm assuming he's a flipper but I could be wrong. I think I remember his saying and showing me on his camera that he has a bunch of Craola and Buff Monster originals.
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Post by jemappellekat on Aug 11, 2010 15:23:22 GMT -8
Fair points to everyone.
I am not against people selling their stuff. And I am aware that the goodie bag is not free since the admission to BT is a little pricey. If the attendees choose to sell off these items, then power to them. Everyone has their own agenda at these type of events. And it's wise to get rid of things that one doesn't need/want and give an opportunity to those that can't make it a chance at something special. I am not even mad about that fact that they went and bought multiple copies of the AK prints since BT should've regulated the sales better. But it gets busy and so they cannot do everything. Plus it's not BT's fault that some people are rotten.
Artists do not have to sketch, and I respect their decision. I personally do not support "artists" that come up with lame reasons for not sketching/signing things, but if they have a good reason then it's all good.
But yeah, all I can do is be a great fan and keep everything that was given to me (like free sketches) or give it away if I really don't see it fitting into my collection. If I paid for it, that's a different story... I am pretty blessed for all the hook-ups but I guess it's because I am not scum, that helps me get these hook-ups.
Sorry for the vent. No argument can change my mind in how I feel about these people/person. I am well aware about stuff appreciating in value. And for anyone arguing that the seller is providing an opportunity for a non-local to get a chance at a piece of art? PLEASE. The interested buyer should just hit up AK and send HER $600 for a sketch.
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Post by crazyreesie on Aug 11, 2010 15:58:41 GMT -8
Oh, IF ONLY I could get a sketch from AK by sending her $600...
Fair points, though.
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Post by epicfai on Aug 11, 2010 19:18:35 GMT -8
those are fair points as well.
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Post by russcel on Aug 11, 2010 21:55:48 GMT -8
I've never sold a sketch that an artist has generously done for
me, in my ten years of collecting lowbrow art, I have around
fifteen sketches, most were personalized to me. I rarely approach
an artist for a sketch, the ones that I do have, are very special
and I'd never sell them.
I've purchased many sketches over the years, I have a large
stack that I'm keeping and a smaller stack that I'll be selling.
For the record, I've never met, talked to or had Audrey Kawasaki
do a free sketch for me. Her sketches were not cheap for me to
buy, I don't think I'm asking crazy prices for them.
I sometimes need to sell some art to be able to purchase other
art, I don't have a bottomless money pit.
For the two people that have made nasty comments towards me,
neither one of you knows me or anything about me, until you get
your facts straight, keep your slanderous words to yourself.
I'm not Wackyfunshop, I know of him and he's a good guy.
Take Care,
Russ
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Post by twocool4u1 on Aug 11, 2010 23:43:21 GMT -8
Russcel
You are correct. I don't know you. I don't know how you do business. However I know those sketches were probably given free to someone at Baby Tattooville. Yes, you could justify that they weren't free because someone paid the hefty admission to BT. But I'm pretty sure there was no money exchanged between the artist and attendee for these sketches. I could be wrong - I wasn't trying to be sketch police. The attendee could have been gracious and given the artist some money for the sketch, but I highly doubt it.
I am not saying that flipping is wrong. It's very grey area. I've bought stuff to turn around and sell. I've bought stuff from flippers. It happens. Its the market of limited stuff. Supply and Demand.
It's just lame when an artist gives a person a good deal on something thinking that the collector will keep it in their collection. Then the collector turns around and sells it for a greater profit when the artist was being nice and could have got the money themselves.
You are right. I don't know the circumstances behind your sale / sales. Just pointing out a fact that I saw and observed.
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Post by shelly on Aug 12, 2010 4:31:18 GMT -8
Geez........ I don't know what all the fuss is about. Twister tags go up every day on ebay and nobody raises an eyebrow. As soon as a low brow freebies goes on ebay then people get bent out of shape. If anything audrey should be happy that her sketches are going on ebay. Twist knows that more than 80 percent of his freebies goes on ebay and he still does them every time you put a book in front of him.
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Post by jemappellekat on Aug 13, 2010 3:40:18 GMT -8
I've never sold a sketch that an artist has generously done for me, in my ten years of collecting lowbrow art, I have around fifteen sketches, most were personalized to me. I rarely approach an artist for a sketch, the ones that I do have, are very special and I'd never sell them. I've purchased many sketches over the years, I have a large stack that I'm keeping and a smaller stack that I'll be selling. For the record, I've never met, talked to or had Audrey Kawasaki do a free sketch for me. Her sketches were not cheap for me to buy, I don't think I'm asking crazy prices for them. I sometimes need to sell some art to be able to purchase other art, I don't have a bottomless money pit. For the two people that have made nasty comments towards me, neither one of you knows me or anything about me, until you get your facts straight, keep your slanderous words to yourself. I'm not Wackyfunshop, I know of him and he's a good guy. Take Care, Russ I knew that when I posted this it would create some heat. I apologize for those that wanted these forums to be a place of peace and discussion, but I couldn't let this slide. russcel: I never actually called "you" out. You and this eBay seller share the same handle name. That is not my fault. So I justify my comments and don't see them as slanderous. I wasn't aware that AK sold sketches (especially during BT), but good for you if you had a chance at these... Whether free or purchased, they are a most welcome addition to almost any home... I am confused because you state that "you are asking for a fair price for them" (possibly implicating that you are the eBay seller), and then you say that you have never met her... So maybe you were the "non-attendee attendee" that had his friend pass out a second sketch book for you and claim your goodie bag, too? If so, good friend that you have for looking uncool for doing this... Hope that you treated him to a nice dinner for the troubles... It's pretty obvious that I share the same feeling with "twocool4u1", but I am allowed to feel this way. Whether (or not) these 2 are the same is of no significance to me. Same sh*t, different piles. Good luck. I hope that you find a person with deep pockets to purchase these and any other items that you may sell in the future. I mean this. I want you continue your pursuit of art buy buying art and re-selling it. This is the AMERICAN WAY. I get it - I'm not stupid nor naive. And to "shelly", artists do get offended. Why should some opportunist make money of their talent/popularity when there is not even attempt to share profits to all involved? Some of my artist friends (that are fortunate to be able to make a living off making art) and I had a discussion over this and while they found it to be a form of flattery, most also feel that it is vile. If I waited in line for a day (12+ hours) or traveled far, only then I could *maybe* justify that $600 price tag. I don't know anything of the example you just described, but I will GOOGLE it out of curiosity. But my title only refers to my disdain for FREE SKETCH ABUSE. I got a print from an artist once that I found out was rancid person... since I couldn't give the print away, I put it up on eBay and made some finds. But I didn't waste his time by making him sketch for me. Graffiti tags/stickers on removable surfaces are different in that these are left on the street for people to take. I don't see many "low brow" artists doing sketches and leaving them around and/or wheat-pasting, but kudos to them if they do. I know that famed comic book artist JIM LEE leaves sketches randomly for his Twitter followers randomly whenever he is a guest. He knows that he is taking a risk by letting anyone that follows him on Twitter have a shot at these, but most that seek them out are hardcore fans that you'd have to kill to pry these out of their hands. But if I were to go up to Jim and tell him that I want a sketch so that I could put it up in eBay, he'd probably get security to b*tch-slap me since he's too nice to do it himself. So please don't think that I am getting all "worked up over nothing". Because to me, this issue is something. And for the record, if anyone wants a "sketch" from AK, I know whom to hit up to make it to *try* and make it happen. I'm all for money going to the appropriate people, such as: the artists, managers, gallery owners, assistants, staff, charities that they represent, etc... |
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Post by russcel on Aug 13, 2010 6:48:23 GMT -8
Hi jemappellekat
You say that you're not calling me out, I don't appreciate your
following comment:
I wouldn't care if these were purchased and then resold, but these were obviously solicited and out of the kindness of her heart, she did them for this a$$
I've purchased these drawings, now I'm reselling them, I am
Russcel on ebay.
I will repeat, I have never met or even seen Audrey in person,
these drawings were not bought from her.
I've purchased hundreds of paintings and have supported many
artists over the last ten years, if I want to sell something or need
to raise extra money, I don't think I'm doing anything wrong by
selling a small % of my collection.
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Post by lowpro on Aug 13, 2010 7:47:01 GMT -8
Russcel has been the recipient of a couple paintings I've had to let go, so I'm fairly sure he's a genuine collector. Without an unlimited bank account, everyone will most likely have to part ways with some art they've owned and never thought they'd sell at some point. Much like the selling of free sketches, which is nothing new at all, it's just the reality of the situation.
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Post by highbrow on Aug 13, 2010 18:54:58 GMT -8
I agree getting something for free for pure profit is not right, however I also fully understand times when you have no choice. Maybe I am a bit harsher as I am never in the position to get a free sketch from an artist. I personally own 1 sketch from an artist and it is from Any Sol. When I first started collecting art before I could really afford I emailed her to tell her what a fan of her work i was and inquire about buying a drawing. She replied she was very busy give her a couple months and she would reply. Sure enough she emailed me asked for my address and a week later a sketch arrived, she never asked for money for it and told me to enjoy it. It currently hangs in my home and I could not fathom selling it.
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Post by oldfartatplay on Aug 13, 2010 20:54:28 GMT -8
I feel that in this situation russcel wants some $ for a sketch he aquired almost a year ago, no big deal.
I don't know but it seems like he's not some sleazy chronic art flipper (I despise those greedy people).
I wouldn't sell that Audrey sketch, no way! It's not too big that it would cost much to frame. Besides it's lovely and unique!
I'd keep that piece and put it on my wall!
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Post by ken on Aug 14, 2010 0:59:55 GMT -8
After helping work the Hi-Fructose booth at this year's SDCC, and attending last year's Baby Tattooville with the Arrested Motion crew, all I can say is that I definitely don't envy the artists when it comes to the free sketches. At this year's Con, many of the artists just sat there dolling out free sketch after free sketch and after a couple hours of this it can be pretty trying on anyone's nerves...
I have one sketchbook and I love it dearly. If I already have a sketch by an artist in it, I don't ask for another by the same artist. Wouldn't dream of ever selling it and never mind if an artist personalizes it to me.
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