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Post by drevil on Jun 27, 2013 16:18:14 GMT -8
These results are crazy but not surprising. I have a hard time looking at this as anything other than some wealthy people propping up Mr. Murillo' stock Well, propping up would be something interested parties would do to protect or support, where you know, as a buyer, you can't get a certain work under a certain price, because someone, say named Larry or Jose, would stop you from succeeding. What you are suggesting for Murillo is actually to build a artist's career through the auction market or to establish pricing. I don't think I would say "build an artist's career." They are building a brand and a market for that brand. Too bad really. Oh well. Looking forward to the day they lose interest. Should be fun to watch from the sidelines.
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Post by drevil on Jun 21, 2013 21:30:44 GMT -8
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Post by drevil on Jun 19, 2013 7:39:41 GMT -8
Between $2,000-$5,500 roughly... The larger ones being around 5.5" tallish. Even the smaller ones feel pretty substantial. Would love a big guy though. 5.5 inches tall??? Whoa. (Sorry couldn't resist)
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Post by drevil on Jun 17, 2013 5:38:29 GMT -8
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Post by drevil on Jun 15, 2013 17:13:40 GMT -8
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Post by drevil on Jun 15, 2013 6:50:49 GMT -8
Would love to see pics if any are available.
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Post by drevil on Jun 14, 2013 17:41:12 GMT -8
i dont know about this, certainly there's enough textural variation in her work to keep me interested. either way 2-3 years spent fleshing out a method/body of work feels normal to me, though admittedly makes for a less gripping short term viewing than some of the other names mentioned in here What I meant was that she's been exploring her dyes for the past couple years and all her solo and group shows have featured them and not any other new series. With Lucien Smith, you've got the rain paintings, guitar bodies, pie paintings, the stuff in Clean Sweep, etc. Sam Falls has a ton of different stuff in his empire of galleries around NYC and LA and abroad. Agree with this. Moyer's stuff all looks basically the same over that period of time. Seems to speak to her level of intelligence, inventiveness, creativity or something along those lines. I don't really have strong feelings about her and mostly ignore her with the exception of this forum. Boring. To. Watch. With someone like Falls he explores certain ideas and materials for a while but the results can be strikingly different. For example dye and water have been explored via logs, hoses, and now rope. The results of each all look pretty different. But similar enough that you can still tell it is his hand or signature at work. Same with fades (dye and light) which he has been working on for almost 4 years now (2009) I think. Fun. To. Watch.
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Post by drevil on Jun 14, 2013 8:10:15 GMT -8
Awesome.
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Post by drevil on Jun 10, 2013 14:13:39 GMT -8
If anyone is thinking about the Light Over Time edition, I would strongly encourage. Nicholas Gottlund is very cool to deal with and I appreciated working with him when adding Light Work to my collection(now no longer in my collection). Actually, I think I should start a thread just on his work as an artist. Light Work would have been so much better framed up and hung as a grid. But it would have probably been much much more expensive in that format. Which is kind of weird to think about since it is the same original artwork in each case. Maybe one day he will rework those Light Work books into a wall art format as part of a retrospective or something. Dare to dream.
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Post by drevil on May 30, 2013 13:07:50 GMT -8
Zing
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Post by drevil on May 27, 2013 16:03:35 GMT -8
oh, completely agree on exception not = rule. Stella is a up with Picasso and Warhol. Murillo is a young man whom I wish well and am excited to see develop. Agree on all accounts. I wish him well but fear for him given the talons in place already.
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Post by drevil on May 27, 2013 15:53:53 GMT -8
Just to shoehorn in Frank Stella everywhere I go, regardless of whether it is appropriate or not, I just want to state that in 1958, at the age of 22, Stella graduated Princeton, moved to NYC, and produced his first Black Painting. In 1959, at the age of 23 and less than a year removed from art school, a few black paintings were included in the show 'Sixteen Americans' at MoMA and he signed with Leo Castelli. I don't really think this applies to anything being discussed here, but I am the official president of the 'Frank Stella is the greatest artist that no one ever talks about on forums' fan club. Exception does not equal rule. If he is the next Stella then so be it. But, no way honestly. Stella = a whole nother level compared to his fella.
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Post by drevil on May 27, 2013 15:39:37 GMT -8
What? Still waiting for evidence about your original assertion. If you are going to say that all of those artists skipped the early phases and prices of their careers then please provide some evidence to back it up. I'm not asking for anything more and would love to be proved wrong. For example, I know for a fact that Tauba's prices were not anything near this when she was with Deitch at the start. I can't help you with your reading comprehension issues. The only thing that affects demand is how much collectors want a certain artist's work and I hate to break it to you, but some of the most significant artists in history have either never graduated and dropped out of art school or never went. People still buy their work. Ha! Come on. Evidence. But I must say that after re-reading this that I'm not really driving at a point revolving completely around the importance of any art of an artist straight out of school. My point is about these sort of crazy high prices for an artist straight out of school. Regardless of its ultimate importance. I don't think this is charted territory at this kind of price level. Maybe I'm wrong.
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Post by drevil on May 27, 2013 15:29:58 GMT -8
Feel free to provide some form of evidence. You said it. Not me. You said something I said was "false" when what you at saying it is false about had nothing to do with what I was saying. And FYI, demand is never correlated to amount of time since an artist has graduated. What? Still waiting for evidence about your original assertion. If you are going to say that all of those artists skipped the early phases and prices of their careers then please provide some evidence to back it up. I'm not asking for anything more and would love to be proved wrong. For example, I know for a fact that Tauba's prices were not anything near this when she was with Deitch at the start.
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Post by drevil on May 27, 2013 15:20:21 GMT -8
Sorry for not clarifying more. What I'm saying is that many of the artists you listed did not actually reach such price heights straight out of school. And private museums = no. How can what you say I said be false if I'm telling you the amount of time an artist is out of school has nothing to do with anything? Feel free to provide some form of evidence. You said it. Not me.
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Post by drevil on May 27, 2013 14:54:03 GMT -8
This is false. Based on my limited knowledge many of these artists had early periods where prices were not so crazy. This poor kid is straight out of school. I honestly feel sorry for him. The money would be nice but the pressure must be immense. I doubt he will ever evolve to something that actually matters historically. Living in the SF Bay Area this feels very much like the 2001 bubble era. Not good. IMO. What exactly is false and what does the amount of time an artist has been out if school have to do with anything? FYI, he's had several solo shows over the past few years, including at multiple museums. Sorry for not clarifying more. What I'm saying is that many of the artists you listed did not actually reach such price heights straight out of school. And private museums = no.
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Post by drevil on May 27, 2013 14:06:28 GMT -8
Also, I don't know if that auction result is indicative of primary pricing or not. If so I find it disturbing. Almost $40k for a 2.5' x 2.5' minor work on canvas? ! I have some pets.com stock if anyone is buying this bubbliciousness. This is normal for new art market darlings. See: Jacob Kassay, Ryan Sullivan, Tauba Auerbach, Thomas Houseago, Matthew Day Jackson, Dan Colen, and so on. There's nothing disturbing about it and primary pricing is not correlated at this stage and is usually a mirage to most collectors. Bubbles are characterized by rapid price appreciation, but that is not the only factor and there is more to causation and you should look at fundamentals. One thing about Murillo, and I don't know how true this rumor is, but he may work very fast and there may be a lot of his stuff out there: www.artforum.com/diary/id=39764"Rumor has it that Oscar Murillo, who the gallery featured last year, sold some four hundred works within a week of his Independent debut." This is false. Based on my limited knowledge many of these artists had early periods where prices were not so crazy. This poor kid is straight out of school. I honestly feel sorry for him. The money would be nice but the pressure must be immense. I doubt he will ever evolve to something that actually matters historically. Living in the SF Bay Area this feels very much like the 2001 bubble era. Not good. IMO.
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Post by drevil on May 27, 2013 9:19:18 GMT -8
I'm really liking his work based on pics I have seen and what I've read. The infusion of community, culture, and shared experiences is really cool and taking some novel steps. Though the end result is sometimes not as appealing to my eye and lacks any real "beauty." To the extent that that is important. But, on the other hand, this guy just graduated last year and has a ways to go to reach a phase with "mature" work that stands apart from past influence. As noted by Mose. Also, I don't know if that auction result is indicative of primary pricing or not. If so I find it disturbing. Almost $40k for a 2.5' x 2.5' minor work on canvas? ! I have some pets.com stock if anyone is buying this bubbliciousness.
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Post by drevil on May 25, 2013 6:23:12 GMT -8
Anecdotally I have observed that if an artist is switching to a better gallery that that news comes first and the mess with the older gallery is cleaned up later. In general, people do not want to lead the news cycle with negative news first. We will see but I would guess this artist will be unrepresented for awhile or longer.
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Post by drevil on May 24, 2013 11:38:21 GMT -8
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Post by drevil on May 23, 2013 5:59:06 GMT -8
I would look to their publishing arm for insight. They appear to be learning from their mistakes in that area and applying them here. For example, I read that they have been signing some decent authors up but have been unable to get much (any?) of the author's work on the best seller list due to the lack of physical store space and the continuing importance of that space in the market yet. Seems they may be taking a different approach here to gain some physical space via collaboration. I read an article in the nytimes within the last six months on this. Might be worth searching out.
But, buyer beware. Good luck.
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Post by drevil on May 6, 2013 21:00:45 GMT -8
I'm liking these latest rain/rope photos. Incorporating the object of the "photograph" into the final piece seems like a pretty cool idea.
Not sure if that has been done before.
Not sure if these are even photos.
Anybody know price ranges?
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Post by drevil on May 6, 2013 16:19:50 GMT -8
Let me try to state this as simply as I can for you then. I stated a general belief that all artists should consider taking the time to write about their work, process, field, etc. I do not need to look at any particular piece of art or artist to have this general belief. I don't have anything more to say to you sail.
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Post by drevil on May 6, 2013 15:10:29 GMT -8
you don't think I made the right choice? but you haven't even seen my work, how can you even begin to comment on my work? see, that's ridiculous. I'm not commenting on your work. I'm commenting on your choice.
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Post by drevil on May 6, 2013 15:03:18 GMT -8
who says your not saying something, just because you don't want to articulate that in fine detail to a vast sea of strangers? as for "fucking it up" if that's how they respond to it, if that's what it says to them, then it's not wrong in their perspective, which is probably the one that should matter the most to them. drevil: I have all the control I need when I'm making the art. if I want to leave it open for the viewer, that's a choice I made, using the control I have. also, lets not underrate the power of a pretty picture. You're an artist? Ok, well that is a choice you made. I just don't think it was the right one. Anyway, back to the news. Metro Pictures huh? That's a pretty big deal. Congrats to the artist this thread is about: Sam Falls. He deserves it.
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